Written, edited, and curated by Eivette Lopez
This collection of interviews and artwork focuses on female artists whose connection to the sea has affected their artwork in multiple ways. It serves as an exploration of external observations transfigured into products of inner power and their translation of personal thoughts, feelings, and experiences into tangible creations.
1. Ann Phong: On Vietnamese
American Identity, Immigration,
Feminism, & Freedom
Interviews edited for length. All images reprinted courtesy of Ann Phong.
Ann Phong is a Vietnamese American fine artist who currently teaches art at California State University Pomona.
When people look at my paintings, I feel like they look at me. They see me there, that becomes my identity,
Ann Phong
Eivette Lopez: How do you incorporate your self identity into your work?
Ann Phong: When we live in America, with a lot of social media and news, we learn something. Not everybody looks at you, the way you think you are. So to make people look at you, the way you think you are, you need to speak up and everybody contributes a little part. For me it’s a fine art artist, I contribute using my visual art, to let people see who I am. So I go that way to let people see I’m not white. I’m not male. I’m not young. I’m not very old. So to do that, I use my own artwork to express it. So when people look at my paintings, I feel like they look at me. They see me there, that becomes my identity.
So people look at my work in a way, they see who I am, why I do it that way, so it doesn’t come from the subject matter, the images, the color use, the brush stroke, the composition and others in the painting, it’s just like a human that when you walk by a human or you walk by a painting, you can’t see much, you only see the surface, until you stop. You talk to the person, or you stop, enjoy the painting, and then think. Then you see more, though if someone talked to me more as they look at my painting for a while, they will see those references pop out, but when it’s a quick look they cannot see it.
EL: As I was studying your paintings, I became aware of the use of the female body, freedom, and feminism through the use of symbolism. So I was wondering if you could speak on those symbols within your paintings?
AP: Since 1993, for more than 20 years, I have used a boat, a small boat, a small vessel, not a big ship to go on vacation. It’s a little one that fishermen, the common people, use to cross the river, to go out. But a lot of us, the Vietnamese American during 1975, after that, we tried to escape a country by boat. So the boat’s pretty small, and it’s dangerous to go through the Pacific Ocean to get out. So during that time, only like 10% of people made it. 90% of people disappear, but there’s no written document to calculate how many people disappeared because they sneak out.
So a lot of people died during that time because of the small vessel and the harsh conditions since there’s a lot of things going on. So I was really lucky that I got out. I use the boat as identity, how I see myself as a small part, how to get out in the big vast ocean, are just one thing as a boat people. There’s a lot of people using small boats to escape, so the boat’s pretty symbolic for many people as an immigrant, not just me, the boat relates to me so I use it.
That’s the beauty of the boat! It’s small, you can anchor anywhere. I don’t draw the seashore, I just draw the boat floating.
Ann Phong
That’s one thing and another thing in the Vietnamese culture, a long time ago, females only depended on a male. So if anyone is a woman and nobody married them or they didn’t want to get married, the saying in that time was, “Oh, she’s a boat without an anchor, without a harbor.” Yeah, and then in America, I mean man that’s the beauty! You have the freedom to go anywhere you want, why would you want to be anchored down? Right, so I look at that, and so to me like every problem, if you know how to look at it, if you have the freedom, it changes the concept. If you’re forced in some culture or your family, you always get stuck.
But when you get out of that circle, you see a bigger spectrum, you see something else. So when I look at it, that’s the beauty of the boat! It’s small, you can anchor anywhere, you can flow anywhere as long as a river, you can go, enjoy the sunset, you can enjoy daylight! So I use it in my paintings a lot. I don’t draw the seashore, I just draw the boat floating.
And so you see the boat and then nothing in my painting. The bulk of it is just the image, and I use it, so I superimposed it with many things on it. The culture I use, the people around us, the water, the ocean, go with a boat, so the boat’s kind of floating, flying, it doesn’t anchor anywhere.
So, I think I appreciate the American culture. They’re pretty open, in a way, but to obtain that openness, we need to have education. We need to learn things in order to see the openness. When I was young, I talked a lot, and my mom always said, “You talk too much nobody will marry you.” Okay. (laughs) And then I come to America, well if I don’t talk, nobody knows anything. So I need to speak up! So, speaking up becomes a tool that you use, not just for yourself, but for a lot of people that you represent. So in my paintings, not just for me but for many females, in general, Vietnamese American people in America, how we look at immigrants, how we look at culture, how we look at the equality between male and females, yes there’s equality, but you have to fight for it.
Yes, there’s equality, but you have to fight for it.
Ann Phong
You don’t just get it for free, to fight for it, you need to have the knowledge, to back you up. You need to have a lot of people that you, collectively, work together to back you up in order to get it when a person cannot get it. So I learned that, and I appreciate it. And in my painting, like one small section in a big section, in a whole big picture, that if everyone put it together, we become something pretty dynamic for people to look at.
EL: That was great. I really like how you talk about not just immigration, but specifically women in immigration, like you said. My mom and my dad immigrated here from Mexico and it’s just really nice to hear someone translate their experiences into an art form.
I use a lot of dramatic things, very dark right next to very light, very soft, right next to something bulky, something smooth, goes with something violent. I use that a lot, because this is how I see female life.
Ann Phong
AP: Thank you. I think one more thing in my paintings is the characteristic of the dramatic. I use a lot of dramatic things, very dark right next to very light, very soft, right next to something bulky, something smooth, goes with something violent. I use that a lot, because this is how I see female life.
We are so delicate and then we are so strong. Yeah, a lot of the time we get oppressed and then we fight back. And a lot of the time, we are so soft that we almost disappear, people won’t see us. And then right next to it, something very dark, because we suffer. So, I juxtapose and I see that a lot in female life. In a family, they protect us, we become so “girly” in a way when we’re little, but when you grow up, you cannot be that, because you get wiped out. People step on you, people do something that you get hurt. You get raped, you get harrassed, there’s a lot of things, you have to protect yourself. So, I look back to a lot of female stories.
I see that so, a lot of time to me, it becomes the energy inside me that I have to use. I express it through my brush stroke and my color, and the shape, the dark and light, the strong and weak, because that’s how we are. We are pretty complex and it shows in the painting.
EL: I definitely agree how there’s some of these traumas and joys with being a woman, and I think it’s only understandable to women.
EL: You redefine the term, “boat people” in your paintings, and you also talk a lot about the American outlook on immigrant communities who emigrated across the sea. So I wanted to ask why it’s important for you to address or rework this phrase in your work?
AP: It’s pretty honest, it’s me. When I escaped the Communists from Vietnam, we didn’t carry any jewelry, we didn’t carry anything expensive. Our body becomes something very important if we can carry our body out of Communism. That’s a lot of bravery already. So, when we escape it’s pretty bare bones. The police won’t spot us during the journey to get out from the city, to the countryside, to the seashore. So when I got out. I felt so good about myself in general, but with my whole generation and that time, I felt like “Oh my god I have, I have a new life.”
Yeah, in a way, not just the boat, even the ocean, the ocean speaks up too, because I look at the ocean like a woman. The ocean is beautiful, but when it’s violent, when when the water gets stirred up, it becomes violent too. So besides the boat, the ocean is one part of the metaphor for a woman too.
Ann Phong
So when I came to America, I carried that positive thinking, but by the time I read the newspaper that positive thinking disappeared, because under the eye of the journalists, when they take photos, they cannot take photos of the bravery of an immigrant. They only can take photos of the surface, how dirty we are, how many days we didn’t take a bath, that’s how dirty you are, the living conditions in the refugee camps and all those images are pretty depressing. And that’s how they show it to the American viewer, they look at those images. Oh, these people are so dirty, so depressed in this harsh living environment. It’s very hard to bring up the brave side of the refugee. So I look at it, and say no, that’s not the complete image of the refugee because, in my own shoes, I see different things.
I see the bravery, the happiness to have a second life, that I have the freedom to rebuild my life so that it becomes beautiful. So to do that, I think I need to speak up, and I speak up with my boat, in a way, it’s pretty simple but it’s very elegant, it flows. It lets people know there’s many sides of boat people, don’t just look at one side. If they want to know more, they can talk to the painting, they can go and look at it. Where’s the boat surrounded at? The composition of the boat, because in some of my paintings, I paint the boat in a big ocean, sometimes I paint the boat with the people in the market. So the boat represents many angles, not just one angle.
So, I use that to speak up. Yeah, in a way, not just the boat, even the ocean, the ocean speaks up too, because I look at the ocean like a woman. The ocean is beautiful, but when it’s violent, it’s very violent, when when the water gets stirred up, it becomes violent too. So, it’s a woman when we are very quiet and tranquil, but when we get stirred up, then we go upside down, just like the ocean. So besides the boat, the ocean is one part of the metaphor for a woman too.
I look at myself like a little boat across the whole Pacific Ocean, that’s me, and that’s the woman in there too, because the boat is a vessel.
Ann Phong
EL: In 2014 you spoke at the Vietnamese Arts and Letters Association during their open mic series, “Common Ground,” and I noticed you mentioned a “triple timing effect” in your work.
So your work obviously represents your own past experiences with life and then viewing your work today, and then, you spoke about this before, it’s also for future generations to reflect on the past or present time. So, I wonder if you could speak on these generational aspects of your work and how do you go about encompassing all of the messages in your painting?
AP: I look back, there were some pretty interesting incidents that happened. The first time was in 1993. I was invited to a picture show in Costa Mesa in Griffin gallery. I had many big and small paintings, and by that time I already found my path. So I talked about the boat people, in general women’s issues too, in the show and that show’s an American gallery. The gallery director asked me why don’t you invite the Vietnamese American people to come and see, because Little Saigon is not too far away from Costa Mesa. I said okay, so he and I went out to the newspaper area and Vietnamese newspaper and some nonprofit organizations live like VALA at that time and then we invited people to come over.
During my opening, there were a lot of Vietnamese American people who came down to see the show. There was one gentleman, pretty well known in the community, he came to me and said, “If you paint a painting like this, nobody would buy your painting.” I said, “Why?” They said, “Because you are a Vietnamese woman, you should paint the Vietnamese woman in a long dress or flowers, and people will buy your paintings. You talk about all the violence and nobody will buy your painting.” I look at him and say, “Oh, okay. But this is me!” Right, so I keep that in mind. I said okay, that’s the difference between you and me. That’s not my past. My past is not the beautiful woman standing against the wall and waiting for the men to come over. No! That’s not me. By that time, I rewrote my artist statement, make it clearer why I do this, why I have the boat and water in my paintings, because that’s me.
I look at myself like a little boat across the whole Pacific Ocean, that’s me, and that’s the woman in there too, because the boat is a vessel. The boat carries people, and the woman carries a baby, that’s a similar thing in there. So I use it, to me that’s my past, but at the same time it’s not one person’s past it’s a whole generation, but I don’t cling to the old image.
So I use the boat and ocean in a way, or, or the Vietnamese fruit, I put in my painting to talk about my past, but it’s me, and I carry it so I put in my painting so, so later on if the children grow up, or the new generation if they want to learn more about the time frame of the Vietnamese American after the Vietnam War or after the Communists took over, they will see different images.
EL: Thank you. Now I just want to give you the opportunity to say anything important that you would like to share regarding your artwork, your connection to the sea, or anything that you want to say.
AP: Thank you. The thing I want to say the most is when I was in my graduate school, I’m talking about the beginning of 1990. Feminism became pretty strong, the female artists spoke up a lot and they talked about, how before them, all the art history writers are male. The female artists didn’t get represented a lot. They built the bridge for the next generation to walk through, without them and to today, the female artists are still nothing. So, they give me strength. I hope I give strength to the next generation, like you right now. We continue to build it up, and we know one person cannot do it, we need a big group.
They already started it and I continue, and then you continue, so by the time the people see, the world combined, male and female. So, we shouldn’t separate between male or female, or even transgender. All of us are human, how we use our intelligent path or artistic path that would contribute to this society. That’s the beauty of the Earth. That opened me up, because without them as me, an Asian American female, I have no place to stand on a history book. So I appreciate that, because I know they did it not just for me, but for many people. I’m just happy I get the benefit. We shouldn’t let the fire go down, we need to continue that torch, to let the fire continue so the next generation has this opportunity.
They enjoy art and create art at the same time. It’s not just fine art, there’s visual art, literature, music performance, everything we call art. So, if we open it up for all the people, male and female, young and old, everybody, the Earth will be a lot prettier that way and then more people will appreciate it that way too. I think that that’s the main thing, I love it.
EL: Thank you so much, that was really inspirational! I feel inspired.
AP: Thank you so much.
For More of Ann Phong’s Work visit: annphongart.com
2. Susan Leonhard: On Self-Reflexivity and Ocean Preservation
All images reprinted courtesy of Susan Leonhard
Susan Leonhard is a native Californian and third-generation artist currently living in Laguna Hills and exhibiting locally in the Southern California area.
Eivette Lopez: Your series of paintings Underwater and Beyond, they have a very serene and naturalistic feeling to it, they’re very realistic. I was curious if you could tell me about the artistic process behind it and your inspiration for depicting those scenes?
Susan Leonhard: Okay, well the inspiration really is, I’ve always been drawn to water as I think most humans are drawn to water, really. There’s just something soothing about hearing the waves, being in the water, being near water, whether it’s a lake or an ocean. I’ve always had a connection. Basically my inspiration for my underwater series literally came from a snorkeling trip off the coast of Kauai, the Na Pali coast, I’ve been going to Kauai for years–since the 1980s–and the Na Pali coast for me is just magical.
I was snorkeling and I thought, I want to capture this feeling that I have underwater, of just the peacefulness, the silence, the beauty of the water and I want to try and paint it. I don’t know whether I can capture it, but I wanted to at least try and it was the transparency of the water, the movement of the water, and the reflections on the ocean floor, that just really inspired me. I thought if I can get all three of those aspects combined in my paintings, I think it will be a believable moment when people look at them and they’ll feel that peacefulness that I feel underwater, and that’s really how that series came about.
EL: I definitely feel that, the reflexivity of the water, how it’s almost forcing you to reflect on yourself.
But I think as humans, when we have a period of quiet and peacefulness, that’s when our creativity, our self-awareness, our soul comes out.
Susan Leonhard
SL: It really is. I think when you’re in quiet and away from the chaos of the world, whether it’s meditation, whether it’s right before you go to sleep, I get a lot of my creative visions right before I go to sleep. Nighttime is my time when I start envisioning the paintings that I’m working on, or what I’m envisioning for my next painting. But I think as humans, when we have a period of quiet and peacefulness, that’s when our creativity, our self-awareness, our soul comes out. There’s a lot of psychologists that believe that when we’re near water, that our whole perspective, that our brain actually calms down and changes so that those creative feelings, those insights, have time to really develop.
EL: Wow, it really strikes me how this moment that you had under the water produced all these feelings for you.
SL: It really did. It started a whole kind of movement, awareness for me, of the ocean and how important it is to preserve it. I started getting involved with talking to people about the ocean, donating paintings to different marine societies, trying to spread awareness of preserving our oceans. It’s really become very important to me, and the main focus of my paintings now. I focus mostly on this series of paintings.
EL: When I first saw your paintings, I was taken aback by how beautiful they were. I was curious to know if those images you paint, if they come from your own mental imagery of what you remember when snorkeling, or if you visit the ocean often? Where do they come from?
SL: I’ve been to Kauai, I don’t know maybe twenty, twenty-five times? I’ve spent a lot of time underwater when I‘m there, so I really have that feeling inside me, and when I paint, I know when they come together and I feel what I feel underwater. It started with me taking a lot of underwater photos in Kauai. I started with very small canvases and working myself up to these big ones. I feel like it doesn’t make the same impact on a small canvas as it does as a very large canvas. You feel like you are in that scene. It all comes together, from photographs and from memory, and I also have a good friend who lives on Kauai, and he will send me a lot of underwater photographs. I experiment a lot! I’ll change the color, I’ll change the movement, I’ll add more bubbles, I’ll experiment with the sand color. I’ve also dived other places, snorkeled other places, where the sand is whiter than Kauai and so I’ll sometimes have a very white sand with contrasting water, different colors, a lot of aquas.
I love looking at the depth of the water, how you can start with pretty aqua water and move into the darker water and it really gives you a sense of what could be beyond. Just swim into it, you know?
Susan Leonhard
EL: I listened to a podcast you were featured in, for a segment called Artist’s Corner, and something that I found interesting that the host brought up was that there was no fish or aquatic life in your paintings. So I was wondering if you could speak on why it’s important for you to not depict any life in the ocean?
SL: Okay, so I appreciate and love to look at all the fish and the marine life, but I wanted these paintings to really reflect the beauty of the water, the color of the water, and I felt if I put a bright fish in there, it would distract from what I was really trying to convey the beauty of the water itself and how mesmerizing that is. The reflections on the sand, I mean if you really look at those, those are just incredible and they’re so serene and peaceful. In fact a lot of the people, customers that have bought these paintings, hang them in their bedrooms and they look at them before they fall asleep. They feel like it really calms them down, and so I didn’t want to focus on the bright beautiful marine life. I really wanted to focus on the water itself and I love, as an artist, I love open spaces, so this was just another example of wide open space and I love looking at the depth of the water, how you can start with pretty aqua water and move into the darker water and it really gives you a sense of what could be beyond. Just swim into it, you know?
EL: Yeah, I definitely noticed that, the duality of the peacefulness but also this mysteriousness to it as well. There’s more to what is being presented on the canvas. There really is, you can swim into it!
SL: Right, and some of the darker paintings that I’ve done with the darker indigos and blues, I wanted to portray that and some of those are my favorite paintings actually, because I feel the drama in them. I’ve been drawn to all cool colors, blues, but the darker indigos, I don’t know, I feel the drama of them. Those paintings that have the darker water, I really feel the mood of swimming into who knows–the unknown–and yeah those are some of my favorites.
Preserving the ocean. It’s so important. The plastics, the trash, how can we destroy something so beautiful? I hope through my art and my underwater paintings, people will appreciate the beauty of the ocean and work really really hard to preserve it.
Susan Leonhard
EL: That’s great. Before we end the interview, I wanted to ask you if there is anything important you would like to share regarding your connection to the sea or your art? Anything you feel is essential to your creativity?
SL: Preserving the ocean. It’s so important. It’s so disturbing to me as human beings, how we are not taking care of our planet and the water. The plastics, the trash, how can we destroy something so beautiful? I hope through my art and my underwater paintings, people will appreciate the beauty of the ocean and work really really hard to preserve it. We have a long way to go.
EL: Definitely, thank you so much for taking the time to speak to me about your art. I think it’s really beautiful.
SL: Thank you. Keep in touch.
For More of Susan Leonhard’s work visit: susanleonhardfineart.com
The Salton Sea Project
Editor’s Note: The artists of “The Salton Sea Project” created an artists’ statement excerpted here: “‘The Salton Sea Project’ (2020-2021) is a site-specific collaboration project during COVID-19 with three Asian female artists exploring the idea of foreign identity, cultural assimilation, and emotional connection juxtaposed with the Salton Sea, an example of a decaying place that has long been abandoned, but the most suitable place to install the artworks during COVID-19 with other artists’ works.”
3. Chloe Jeongmyo Kim: On Emotional Catharsis at the Abandoned Salton Sea
All images reprinted courtesy of Chloe Jeongmyo Kim
Chloe Jeongmyo Kim is a Korean artist who immigrated to the United States in 2012 and continues to explore her career as a fine art artist in Orange County where she has permanently settled.
Eivette Lopez: I want to begin by asking how your Korean culture, past travel experiences, perspectives, and constant relocating shape the way you translate messages into your art? How does your self identity affect your work?
Chloe Jeongmyo Kim: I am a Korean, immigrated to the United States in 2012, and lived as a nomad for several years before planting my roots in southern California. I was blessed to have a myriad of experiences living in many different countries and cities including Seoul, Washington D.C., New York, Hong Kong, Michigan, and Los Angeles. Although wildly exciting to visit the new places, I felt tremendous turmoil adjusting and readjusting to different cultures and lifestyles, knowing that my temporary stay would be short-lived. But through my journey, I’ve found rays of sunlight beaming through my Korean cultural background allowing me to see the world through vivid lenses. With the influence from a variety of cultures and places, my unique identity turned out into my artwork.
EL: Throughout your work, I noticed a consistent use of layering in regards to materials such as plexiglass, paint colors, tape, and other materials which speaks to the clash of translucency and opacity. How does this technique relate to your artistic process?
CJK: In order to express these strong emotional responses and to explore the after-tastes of my flavorful experiences, I intermix various painting gestures with the representational photographic images. These two elements create profound visual narratives on top of the natural transparency. Comparing with canvas, the physicality of the transparent sheet of plexiglass doesn’t have representational value. It is something we
can look through but it gives me a sense of freedom. While sparingly layered both sides, front and back, my hybrid identity is manifested. By leaving empty space to invite penetrating light, I create phenomenological and affectual depths on a transparent surface, which echoes the
contrast found between human-touched expressions and the dehumanized manual world.
EL: Your most current project “The Salton Sea Project,” a collaboration with three Chinese artists, encompasses sculptural photographic pieces as both a visual and emotional response to the current COVID-19 pandemic juxtaposed with the Salton Sea, an inland sea which has long been abandoned. May you please expand on this project and discuss how the connection to this particular sea motivated your participation?
CJK: The COVID-19 pandemic threatens human life worldwide and has devastated millions of lives. The current crisis had a deeper impact on the Asian community. Research has shown, racial discrimination against people of Chinese and other Asian ethnicities has risen sharply especially in the United States. Also, with violent crime and using derogatory phrases such as the Yellow Peril, Model Minority, and Chinese Virus.
Within the Asian immigrant artist’s point of view, I want to express my alienated and frustrated emotion during the pandemic through the Salton Sea project.
Chloe Jeongmyo Kim
I am a Korean, immigrated to the United States in 2012. I have been living as a perpetual outsider. I passionately started the second stage of my life here, where I thought the multicultural aspects of America is what makes this country so beautiful and that it is the perfect place to show my artistic desire to various audiences from different cultures, backgrounds, and points of view. However, under the current political climate with the widespread notion: the “model minority stereotype” (Asians in success makes potential competition or threats to the other racial group), against the backdrop of COVID-19, I felt awfully devastated seeing the gap between my ideological perception and the fact of reality with my own political lens. Within the Asian immigrant artist’s point of view, I want to express my alienated and frustrated emotion during the pandemic through the Salton Sea project.
My ambiguous Asian identity transformed into the translucent sculptural medium. I brought the work to the most abandoned body of water, the Salton Sea. I juxtaposed the abandoned objects from the site with a vast expanse of unprotected water creating an immersive narrative.
Chloe Jeongmyo Kim
This project includes the ‘Stagnant Dream’ work that is a composition of two sculptural painting pieces referencing my exploration of abandoned places and objects, affected by COVID, near where I lived in Southern California. Even today, communal places where there were many
residents such as the community pool, barbecue grilled area, and a small trail were now turned into abandoned places. And, there were a lot of objects that I could identify with as they all seemed to be very alienated. All of a sudden, the swimming pool strongly caught my eyes. It resonated as a drowsy and mac and cheesy taste of Western vibe, but there was a dreary feeling as if it it as never used or taken care of, like a pool of abandoned stagnant water. Withered palm tree leaves and dead insects floated on the bleach and chlorine water surface, slowly sinking to the bottom of the pool.
I tried to infuse my ongoing discomfort into my artwork by applying translucent material and layering hand-cut photographic images with buttery colors. My ambiguous Asian identity transformed into the translucent sculptural medium. I brought the work to the most abandoned
body of water, the Salton Sea. I juxtaposed the abandoned objects from the site with a vast expanse of unprotected water creating an immersive narrative. I put into play my plain dream by interacting with the surrounding environment and interplaying with natural light and shadow to create the extraordinary “Stagnant Dream.”
For More of Chloe Jeongmyo Kim’s work visit: chloejmkim.com
4. Liang Zhang: Bridging Connections during COVID-19 through Art
All images reprinted courtesy of Liang Zhang
Liang Zhang is a Chinese artist whose artwork focuses primarily on unglazed ceramics and their ability to create connections, interactivity, and conversations between humans.
Eivette Lopez: How does your self identity, personal perspectives and experiences affect your work, if at all?
Liang Zhang: I didn’t realize it until I grew up. I was born and raised in Beijing, China, and my family is 100% Chinese. Compare to my childhood friends, my family gave me very little pressure on school grade, and the private school I went to has a lot of social practice classes instead of a huge amount of homework and exams. I’m very glad that this relaxed environment gave me chances to think about things and practice with the skills learned, but I also got the idea of what is the basic line and what I can explore when I was little. I think that is the most important experience to form my style of art practice: looking for the different possibilities under a regulation.
What I love the most about art is that we can “talk” by viewing the same work, I have an idea, and I make a carrier, and I put on my thoughts into it, then the viewers make effort to finish the work by interacting.
Liang Zhang
EL: In your most recent statement on your personal website regarding your artwork, you state, “Most of my works have a relation to nature or dealing with the relation between nature and human, in other words, the contrast between body and mind, organic and artificial, and controlled and uncontrolled.” May you please elaborate on this statement further and how it is incorporated into your work?
LZ: I’m very interested in how to balance things. I always have both controlled lines (grid) and uncontrolled patterns in the same work. It is beautiful to see the contradictions under a set rule, just the same as diversity and allowing different voices in the world under basic laws. We can easily make two identical things by using a machine, but it is more attractive to make it humanistic by putting labor and effort into it.
EL: Throughout your work, I noticed your use of unglazed ceramics and how this connects to the interactivity of your pieces. Why is it important for you to incorporate interactivity within your artwork and how does it reflect onto the hands-on experience of working with ceramics?
LZ: We are taught not to touch an artwork to protect it from damage, but there are also a lot of artworks are interactive or inviting viewers to go into the installation and experience. I prefer a way to create an artwork with my viewers. What I love the most about art is that we can “talk” by viewing the same work, I have an idea, and I make a carrier, and I put on my thoughts into it, then the viewers make effort to finish the work by interacting.
For example, in the Salton Sea project, travelers and viewers touch the work, try to pick it up, the Chain may break due to its fragility, it is not damaging the work, it is part of the life of this work, the appearance contains the time, the action, and the motive, it is a record of history and experience.
People might be strangers but they definitely can have something the same, it can be their experience, it can be their favorite food, it can be what they think on an issue, all of those similarities can make a stating point of that “bridge.”
Liang Zhang
EL: In an interview with L.A. Artcore Director Pranay Reddy you stated that, “So the ceramic piece is like a connection between two strangers. We don’t know each other, we don’t talk directly to each other, but we have something here, an object here that has both of our thoughts or our actions.” This statement is really powerful in regards to how
connections can be made through art. How does your work aim to establish connections between humans and create conversations?
LZ: I aim to make art that can evoke viewer’s memory or share the same thoughts with what I’m trying to express. People might be strangers but they definitely can have something the same, it can be their experience, it can be their favorite food, it can be what they think on an issue, all of those similarities can make a starting point of that “bridge.” When people touch the same object (the artwork in this situation), they put their history, energy and current mood into it, then the object becomes a carrier of the communication.
EL: How did you become involved in this project?
LZ: We are a group of Asian women artists graduated from Otis College of Art and Design, starting from the pandemic, we have Zoom meeting twice a week to talk about art, and finally decide to do a project together, respond to COVID-19 and the change because of that.
EL: What was the process like for creating your installments?
LZ: I separate the clay into small pieces (people are separated due to the stay-at-home order); I make the chain with those parts (people are tired of work at home without any communication and start to video chat more/ spend more time on social media/hanging out outdoor); I installed the work at Salton Sea and the work is under sun/ wind/ rain/ touched by
people (the relationship between coworkers, classmates, families, friends are changed due to the separation, no matter better or worse); The chain breaks and dissolves into dirt (after a long period of time people are getting
used to the way of living under pandemic).
EL: How has COVID-19 affected your experience as an artist or inspired your installment for this project?
LZ: I lost the chance of making art in a shared studio, where I could share thoughts and get feedback from other people, so during the pandemic and the “stay-at-home order” I thought a lot about how important it is to share emotion and make connection with people, those bridges are also a very fragile.
EL: Is there anything else important you would like to share regarding your art?
LZ: It was a great experience working with the other two artists Chloe and Xiaoxiao, and our videographer Sunyin, it was so nice to meet other people in person during the pandemic so that no one feel isolated. For the Salton Sea project, we are still coming up idea of the title and finishing up the statement as of April 2021, and my work “When the Chain Breaks” is still an ongoing project. I add new chains and document the site every time I go.
For More of Liang Zhang’s work visit: liangzhang.art
4. XiaoXiao Wu: On Reworking Cultural Language & “Fitting In”
All images reprinted courtesy of XiaoXiao Wu
XiaoXiao Wu is a Chinese artist whose artwork focuses on humanistic and mechanical languages which mark this relationship as a boundary between the digital and nondigital world.
Eivette Lopez: How does your self identity or your personal perspective and experiences affect your work?
XiaoXiao Wu: My name is XiaoXiao Wu and I come from China. I studied here about six years ago in Oregon. Basically, my work is about the perspective about alienation during modern society. So, what I’m doing, I’m not an immigrant, my self identity I take as an international student. My perspective is also about the cultural language, speaking about society’s alienation effect on our human body. So, my cultural language is not only using elements of China, but also about the Chinese. I’m also using a common language to affect my work. So sometimes you will see some cultural language in my work, but not only that, like the Chinese elements.
We not only talked about the Asian American, we also talked about, because we are not born and raised in the United States, we talked about the general East Asian perspective reflecting onto COVID-19. This misunderstanding translates to the whole Western society.
XiaoXiao Wu
EL: Did you create anything as an installment for the project?
XW: Yeah, let me find the picture. This is my major collage, it’s a canvas. Also, I used the rice paper for the Asian elements. I also used some fabric and this is the gap of the wall. I put the collage in this gap and I tried to try to make it fit inside this hole. It’s all rice paper and acrylic, and the fabric.
EL: Would you like to expand on this project and discuss your involvement in it?
So, to talk about the Salton Sea project, I need to talk about the Alter bridge group. So, the Alter Bridge group during COVID-19, we started out in 2020 March, before COVID-19. Then after 2020 March, COVID-19 happened and we went online. Each participant from the Alter Bridge group, most of them, comes from East Asian cultural backgrounds. We were not born in the United States, but we come to the United States to learn about art. In this discussion group, we talked about focusing on the mistranslation, the misunderstanding and the situation during COVID-19 for the Asian people. We not only talked about the Asian American, we also talked about, because we are not born and raised in the United States, we talked about the general East Asian perspective reflecting onto COVID-19. This misunderstanding translates to the whole Western society.
At that time we liked focusing on these things, then the discussion group took a break. We only had three members so we think it’s not enough for discussions. After one year, we thought about why we are during a collaboration exhibition about COVID-19’s effect on international East Asian students. We tried to choose a place and an on-site project. We particularly chose the Salton Sea, because we checked its background and it’s kind of like an abandoned city. The city becomes smaller and smaller and smaller because of the pollution. This abandoned city theme is very very fitting for our topic. We tried to discuss East Asian identity and how international students fit in Western culture. Then we found that this place fits our theme and COVID-19.
EL: What was the process like when you were creating this? What inspired you to create this piece?
XW: My previous projects all use the sound or the wood, some elements I use for installations. I never use cloth or the painting as my elements for doing projects, so I wanted to try doing, because of COVID-19, try to use online sources to create digital paintings or drawings. I tried to use these elements, but not digital to affect my work, because I never tried before, the cloth and also the rice paper. I mean sometimes, a lot of Chinese students or a lot of international or particular Chinese artists use the rice paper to do their project. I think I don’t really like to use the rice paper because it’s very, I will say cliché. It also has the Chinese perspective of doing that, but now I want to try if I can use the rice paper, but not as an Asian element. Also, like combining it with the “fitting in” theme. It’s kind of very challenging to do that.
Human body and the mind disciplined by society, sometimes is powerless, and even more modern people are not aware of their physical situation. It is a complicated issue.
XiaoXiao Wu
EL: What does this represent for you?
XW: Generally speaking, I pay attention to all kinds of social issues but focus on tracking the living conditions of disadvantaged groups. As a Chinese person currently living in the United States, during COVID-19, I will naturally focus more on the differentiation of information between countries even living in a developing data network society. The high transparency of information in modern society and the degeneration of human thinking logic for information are not simple problems of causal order. Internet algorithms are so developed, global information network is highly asymmetrical, how text and vision can highly alienate and assimilate human beings.
Humans have observed more and more the over-information oppression off the flesh and thoughts, both explicit and invisible, even modern people who have received a good education and have a relatively open living space also continue suffering from this. Human body and the mind disciplined by society, sometimes is powerless, and even more modern people are not aware of their physical situation. It is a complicated issue. In fact, I am also trying to explore some of the root causes behind the phenomenon through creation and writing, although what I can perceive is only the tip of the iceberg. The complexity of the causal framework often leads me to new puzzles. Therefore, I hope to find some roots for exploration through interdisciplinary observation and analysis in the ‘Squeeze In.’
When an artistic work tries to remove its original artistry and only has the function of ‘filling,’ does it mean that the material will change due to changes in the surrounding environment?
XiaoXiao Wu
In my practice, I try to use different ways of artistic expression to show different artistic perceptions, interpretations, and contexts in my practice. For example, when the writing collage by character, the readers’ perceptive mode focuses more on spatial poetic imagination and social cognition. But this social cognition is different from object social cognition. But when deprived of the poetic of words, only left the functionality of language cognition, combined with the recognition object.
The combination of these two scenes can be powerful. For ‘Squeeze In,’ this work is deconstructed and reconstructed, whether it is the sociality of the overall work or the function of one of the materials (rice paper), and new meaning is created through repeated attempts. The work itself is trying to create a new boundary exploration. When an artistic work tries to remove its original artistry and only has the function of ‘filling,’ does it mean that the material will change due to changes in the surrounding environment? This is what I want to talk about.
For More of XiaoXiao Wu’s work visit: xiaoxiaowu.work
5. Sunyin Zhang: Behind the Scenes of “The Salton Sea Project”
Sunyin Zhang is a Chinese film director whose narrative shorts focus primarily on female characters and adventure. Currently, she is creating a brief documentary for “The Salton Sea Project.”
Eivette Lopez: How would you say that your identity or your experiences or different perspectives throughout your life have influenced your work, if at all?
Sunyin Zhang: I feel like the word is still being dominated by the gender and as a female, especially an Asian female director studying abroad, it’s harder to get involved in the Western culture, especially because my language skills aren’t that good. So sometimes I couldn’t express myself as clearly and kind of humorous [as I could] in my own language. And also, I don’t think my skills are weaker than the others. I think the Asian title and the female title, kind of weaken my strength and kind of make it harder [for me] to survive this competition, but I also feel it is a pride of ours, as society recognizes this issue and they are offering more opportunities to Asian women, as well as Asian queer. So I think it’s a good thing but at the same time also a bad thing, both bringing balance.
EL: May you expand on how you became involved with the project and your part in it?
SZ: First, I was just introduced by my wife Liang. She was involved in this project and I know they were kind of developing it for a long time. First, I was thinking about making a live performance in the Salton Sea project but they were trying to make it site specific and I feel like it’s harder for me during quarantine, as a performer, to be watched by people. I didn’t want to do a live performance because I didn’t want to be on a screen. I feel more comfortable with people in a live audience.
So I decided on just helping them with making a documentary. I was thinking about making this documentary into two parts. The first part is shorter, maybe around three to five minutes, and then I can give them more detail about what they’re trying to do and what they’re trying to tell the others, or share with society.
The other part is more like a trailer on something to get attention. And then, personally for this documentary, we have our scouting footage in the Salton Sea. During scouting there were lots of installations already on the beach, like a pink sofa, something really cute. And we also went to some abandoned house around the Salton Sea. They really surprised me. They had lots of our decorations in the abandoned house, like murals and lots of images. I feel like why they chose the Salton Sea is also a good starting point. I feel like I can introduce the Salton Sea a little bit because there are also lots of artists making stuff at the Salton Sea. I might mix in a little bit of the atmosphere of the Salton Sea into this documentary as well. So that’s what I will use for the scouting point. Next I would, it’s kind of more basic I think, but maybe I will record their Zoom to introduce their stuff, and mix in a bit about how they are making their stuff and how they are installing it. There were some accidents when they were installing their stuff because the sand is pretty soft and they cannot stand and be stable.
When Chloe was trying to put her stuff on the sand, she had gotten onto the sand and had fallen down. Because the Salton Sea smells really bad, she had gotten dirt on her and smelled bad. I feel like, with these parts, I wouldn’t delete them. I feel like people can see how artists work when they’re outside for a site-specific job. I feel like these parts are funny, as well as creating a closer connection to the audience.
I was also thinking about using text on the project as well. I feel like, because I’m going to use Zoom recording and Zoom interview, if I just put two screens or three screens in the documentary, it will be a little bit boring. Maybe I will put some text as a way of animation to make it easier to digest and then make some stop-motion pictures on it to make it more lively. That’s something I need to do later. And then for the trailer part, we have not decided yet what kind of style we want and how long it could be, but personally I suggest it will be 30 seconds, because short videos are more attractive nowadays. People don’t have too much time. That’s something we need to decide: what kind of style and how short, and what kind of point we should focus on in this short.
I think a little bit of animation would be suitable for this project too. Salton Sea is kind of a colorful place, most of the color would be yellow and blue. The Salton Sea town, it would be really colorful; pink, silver, golden, blue, green, everything you can see, is also something I can use. Yeah, that’s it.